>>3

During the time of Zeon Zum Daikun, it might have been different, but the Zabi-led Zeon can be considered the villains.

In that sense, Char, who operates against the Zabi family, may not necessarily be seen as a villain…

It’s said that opposite justice exists, but sometimes there’s no need to listen to the reasoning of the villains…

Char from Zeta is also a bad guy, right?

>>6

They are a foolish person.

It’s fine that Zeon is the villain, but it’s hard to say that the Federation is the good side.

Amuro is the better one, but…

>>7

It is not good to classify things as good or bad between the Federation and Zeon.

Char is a bad guy.

>>7

In the first place, the enemy’s tyranny must not be tolerated.

Both the bosses and the order side are no good, that’s what Gundam is.

Let’s put aside those who have a certain political sense of justice for now.

It seems that there is an impression of simplifying the discussion by placing those with strong discriminatory awareness or those seeking conflict as the villains.

The most efficient way to make Gundam fans angry.

Char is on the creepy side.

Isn’t Amuro the one who feels good?

While revenge itself is fine, it’s unfortunate that Garma and Kycilia’s subordinates are getting caught up in it.

>>14

In that sense, Char is not really a hero.

Char has done a lot of bad things, and he’s messed up various relationships, so there’s no way to describe him as anything other than a villain.

There is no need to meet expectations.

>>22

Isn’t Zeon also attacking other colonies?

Char in Char’s Counterattack is a bad and dirty adult.

Well then, it all comes back to the basic concept of post-war anime, which is that trying to solve things through war is bad.

Ikeda was finally happy that Zeta had a decent character, but the treatment in Char’s Counterattack is harsh.

It definitely increased after Zeke Axus, right?

People living in the Universal Century

In the world of Zeke Axus, the federation was also trying to drop onto the city, so the argument of “both sides are the same” would hold true.

Isn’t Char vs. the Zabi family simply a case of good versus evil?

When watching UC, the Federation seems worse than Zeon.

You idiot! It’s not such a simple story!

From the perspective of public psychology, Char is a popular figure, and there are aspects of his behavior that correspond to that popularity.

The person who played the role was feeling down, as they had no idea what Char wanted to do after Char’s Counterattack, yet for some reason, Char’s popularity kept rising and their work increased, leaving them with a mixed feeling.

If it’s the evil chosen by public opinion, then it’s just Hitler.

Both are pretty awful, but the Zeon aliens tend to do extreme things.

No matter how you look at it, Char will never become something good.

Amuro is generally a good thing…

What the Principality of Zeon did is really crazy, but it’s not portrayed that much in the visuals and is instead just talked about, which is not good.

The federation is rotten, but it hasn’t committed such atrocities against humanity as a whole.

>>38

It is true that the Zeon is worse, but it’s wrong to defend the Federation by comparison.

The policy of forcibly relocating all of humanity has started and then been interrupted, leaving only the upper class; that would truly be an atrocity rivaling that of Zeon.

If you’re saying that the creation of the colony by the Federation is bad, then I think it should have been done simultaneously in the anime.

>>39

Public corporations tax water and air, and if you can’t pay, it’s forced labor!

I feel like they were saying that around ZZ.

Char is cool because he’s a villain.

Even though they’re the villain, there’s something cool about them, but their slightly uncool side is also cool.

Deging is a good person.

Giren is the bad one, right?

I don’t know if a federation that uses children as tools of war is just.

I want to hear about Char using the service area.

The Zeon side is cool because they have beliefs, unlike the Federation.

If only the upper class remains on Earth, who will do the work?

Even if we say the Federation is bad, it does not justify Zeon’s actions.

That’s why in recent years, they’ve been desperately acting like the Federation is the bad guy!!

The level of that bad thing is at a level that can only be thought of by elementary and middle school students, so there really is no way to justify Zeon’s actions, right?

Regardless of Yamachann’s understanding of Gundam, there is a strong sense that the role he plays will likely be killed off quickly in a Tomino anime.

It seems that Tomino intends to kill off characters.

The Federation is so terrible that it’s only reasonable for the Space Noids to side with Zeon…

It’s immature to perceive the discussion of “both are wrong” as justification.

No, it’s a story meant to convey that war itself is evil, so understand that.

Both sides that engage in war are at fault.

>>54

As for individual good or bad, it’s fine if war is like this, right…?

>>54

If we are invaded, of course we will fight back…

>>59

It’s not an invasion war, it’s the One Year War.

The legitimacy of the Zeon as exploited space inhabitants disappeared at the point when they were attacking other colonies during the One Year War.

>>58

However, you see…

Sides 1 and 2 are wicked space noids that are subordinate to the foolish Earth Federation, so it’s only natural that they would be dealt with by the righteous Zeon army.

War is not good, it’s bad, and that’s true, but to say it’s a draw, the things that Zeon has done are just a bit too much…

It’s shocking enough that there’s a mass murder of civilians from the colony due to a colony drop, but the fact that people from the same colony, who were also oppressed by the Federation, were mass murdered with poison gas is completely devoid of justice or legitimacy, and is astonishing in a different way.

So that’s why the colonel was spreading rumors about being a mama’s boy and a lolicon…

I don’t quite understand why Amuro is considered a good guy, but it seems he is harmless.

>>63

It’s not just a perspective that says the protagonist has legitimacy simply because they are the protagonist.

It’s impossible to say that at least Zeon isn’t bad…

I was a little surprised to learn that Mr. Ikeda liked Gundam that much.

>>66

It’s said that one of the major features of Gundam is that it portrayed “war” in a substantial way, not just a simple battle between good and evil.

There might be things that you don’t want to be categorized as either good or bad.

>>71

I can understand saying this for Dougram, but can you really say this for Gundam…?

>>86

That’s precisely because it’s Gundam.

If the Earth Federation properly managed the colonies, the Space Noise independence movement wouldn’t have occurred.

>>68

That has nothing to do with the various wrongdoings of the Zabi family and their sympathizers.

>>69

The same goes for the opposite.

>>69

Huh? It definitely has a lot to do with it.

>>98

How is spreading poison gas in the colony and dropping it on Earth related to the independence movement when you are fighting against the exploitation of the colony?

>>190

Hmm, the rising dissatisfaction towards the Federation is supporting the rights of the Zeon space noids!

The story is about how the Zabi family skillfully drew that to themselves, leading to mass killings. Do you understand?

>>196

Do you want to talk about how the Zabi family came to power? Or do you want to discuss the legitimacy of the independence movement?

The Zabi family, who assassinated Mr. Zeon, who was trying to achieve independence peacefully, is to blame.

But retaliate with the anger of justice, Gundam…

>>72

Alright, the sponsors have left.

There is no justice in the war between Zeon and the Federation.

That said, Char is a bad guy.

>>73

Where are Char’s bad traits?

>>76

The place where a meteorite is about to fall.

>>77

Isn’t it CCA?

>>77

It’s also the fault of the old Earthlings who cling to the Earth forever…

>>80

It’s true for anything, but isn’t it easy for someone to become bad if they do extreme things, regardless of their motivations or the legitimacy of their actions?

Zion is forgiven because all the characters are cool in some way.

I don’t like the federation because it’s full of corrupt people.

The discussion is about what constitutes justice if dropping Axis is considered evil.

Recently, I’ve been feeling like I love to unleash the righteous anger against the evil Zeon.

>>83

Is that so?

Thunderbolt is trash for all factions.

The story is that if the Federation is cornered, they will do the same thing as Jiku Ax.

In a defensive war, there may be evil, but there is no justice.

Why is it that every single time, what you do is so extreme…!! This is Zeon.

The federation is insidious and malicious.

The original Gundam clearly portrays Zeon as evil, right…?

I think it’s a work that also writes from the perspective of the other side, not just about good and evil.

At the field level, the drama aside, Zeon itself is definitely evil…

The character of individual Zeon soldiers aside, the organization of Zeon cannot be defended.

Even if I say it’s the anger of justice, I’m desperately trying to survive.

Amuro isn’t exactly a warrior of justice to that extent either.

No one wants to die, right…?

>>92

If anything, the true colossal enemy is the Federation…

I think it’s basically depicted in all series that the ideologies of the field and the organization are different for both camps.

On the Federation’s side, Amuro’s intentions differ from those of the Federation government.

It’s true that Zabi is evil, but there’s no righteousness in Casval’s revenge.

Char Aznable is dead.

I recently started watching the original Gundam.

Not just the Zeon Castle that I had prior knowledge of, but also the Musai’s bridge was so evil empire-like that it made me laugh.

Was there any other Gundam besides Gunei?

>>96

Old games like Yu Kazama.

>>96

Master P Layer

If there was a righteous organization, the Universal Century wouldn’t be such a hellish scene.

Basically, I can’t help but think that the argument “There are good Zaku soldiers too, so they aren’t evil” applies to the Federation as well.

>>101

It’s the federation too.

Both sides are just doing what they can on the ground.

But to unleash the wrath of justice, Gundam…

Even if you talk about the origin, you know…

It would be more natural to have a forged resident card than to have someone who accidentally looks just like you.

In the first place, at the time of the First, Char isn’t really active and is more like a source of harassment and chaos.

At the time of the first generation, it was hard to understand the oppression of the Federation, and there were some shady aspects, but it wasn’t necessarily evil, and there were good people as well, so I don’t think it’s unreasonable to interpret it as Amuro being a good guy and Zeon being the bad guys.

>>110

The Federation is quite unpleasant, but there are some refreshing characters in Zeon, so it’s the opposite in the first anime, right?

Amuro was sleeping with the mother of a Federation soldier.

>>110

The Zeon popularity was also strong in the anime production scene.

From the tense Federation and White Base in the setting’s background, rather than the story itself.

I’m watching some pleasant Zeon soldiers.

Yamachan’s story is about how he got scolded by Ikeda Shuichi for saying that Gundam is not like that…

Even at A Baoa Qu, Char was active in annihilating the Tianem fleet.

>>112

Tianmu is Big Zam with Solomon…

In the first installment, the symbol of evil, the colony drop, isn’t even something to be resented.

It’s frustrating to see a troublesome fan getting half angry at someone with low comprehension, even though they’re fed up with the situation.

>>116

Well, I’ve been a seasoned fan for a long time…

Check out Zoom City.

It’s unreasonable to say that there is no evil in that building.

Finally, it’s the end of the war before the declaration of the end of the war… I love the contrast between Mai-Mai, who is completely exhausted, and the federal soldier who is unleashing his murderous intent while being shot by a solar ray right there.

The Zabi family and M’Quve are depicted as evil, but I feel that the soldiers on the front lines, led by Ramba Ral, are certainly not portrayed as bad.

Rather, that may be the element that appealed to people.

The depiction of unpleasant characters from Zeon became more prominent after the student mobilization and Gilren’s increased appearances.

At that time, I think it’s also because there are characters like Lalah and Newtypes appearing, which confuses the viewers and makes it less memorable.

>>122

From Gene already…

>>125

You wouldn’t say it’s an unpleasant guy, would you?

Could it be that the theme song is just too hard to understand?

Next, let’s have Bump do the theme song.

If we limit it to the first anime, the Federation military only makes ambiguous statements that restrict the hands and feet of the WB crew, so it doesn’t seem like the Federation is any good.

First of all, the fact that the WB team is made up entirely of former civilians and continues to fight…

>>126

Those who stay behind instead of getting off when they can are acting on their own will.

Before that, it was a situation where we had to fight or we would die, rather than just talking about it.

>>131

The reply from the elders of the Riga Militia.

From the viewer’s perspective who has been following the White Base since episode one,

“The federal government says, ‘You guys should normally be going to prison,’ which is really infuriating.”

The daily life of the wooden horse is probably based on things like Lord of the Flies, rather than Gundam.

General Reville, who has a kind-looking face, surprised me a bit with his hardline stance.

The side that starts the war uses the opponent’s mistakes as a reason.

When I was able to get off, it was Kazu.

With the remaining White Base members until the end

Wasn’t the only chance to get off at Katsuretsu Kikka?

Kai’s escape was that.

Huh? The reaction of “Is everyone a child soldier? Seriously?” seems to be more from the Zaku side.

Even the mobilization of students by Zeon would involve university students, so it’s not as serious as WB.

It’s not visually cool for the side of justice to win by numbers.

The Lar team was constantly surprised to find that Artesia was mixed in with the kids when they directly initiated the attack.

There’s no way that a round, green, one-eyed robot with a pipe sticking out looks like a hero.

The worst guy is that Anaheim, right!

I understand that both the colonies and the Earth Federation have their issues, but the Zaft during the One Year War were a serious problem from both the Federation’s and the colonies’ perspectives…

The worst is Sasuro.

If there are three eyes, it’s a protagonist mech.

Since everyone is originally doing this for work, there aren’t really many like “We, the righteous Federation, will judge Zeon!” right?

>>147

If Revil hadn’t been so stubborn in the first place.

It was decided that it was fine to have a ceasefire that favored Zeon.

Looking at it again, I’m surprised by how sparse the settings are in the first part.

The successor, with its outstanding presence, the evil empire Anaheim Electronics doesn’t even make an appearance.

Even if the premise of the Space Noids’ independence and similar justifications have validity for Zeon, the methods they employed for that purpose are inexcusable and too evil to defend.

Even if there were a scenario where Zeon won, there are aspects of their actions that are so villainous it can’t be accepted.

The Titans also tried to do the same thing with a colony drop on the Moon.

>>151

The Titans are evil, right?

>>152

Compared to the federal government that caused the glove incident and covered it up, this is nothing serious.

>>158

It’s quite something to compare the Titans who annihilated a thousand people in a rave and three colonies…

>>158

Just because there are worse people doesn’t mean you’re not bad.

Were there people living in the colony during the colony drop?

Both are crap, so there’s no difference between the Federation and Zeon.

It’s nice that the Titans are doing all the bad deeds that Zeon did.

Well, it’s also because the top guy is someone who believes in the ideology of Giren Zabi himself rather than Giren Zabi.

Even though we went through the trouble of defeating the Titans and Hamarn, it’s frustrating that now the AEUG side is becoming corrupt.

Why was everyone overlooking the short-sleeved shirt that almost everyone recognized?

If we had dealt with it there, we could have avoided the reverse Char.

>>161

Char is popular among the spacenoids.

>>164

On the contrary, it was a state of wondering why you were holding short sleeves but not using it as a sign.

>>161

How do you handle it when you’re hit with an absolutely valid argument?

If someone doesn’t become a villain, humanity will perish!

That tends to become the final boss in Gundam.

>>162

“The Gundam protagonists who believe the next generation will figure it out!”

It’s difficult to use something as radical as Hathaway as a standard for corruption.

In the first place, AEU itself has a lot of suspicious characters involved besides Char.

>>168

After all, it’s just an irregular military organization.

Even Hathaway knows that victory is justice.

Mafty could become a celestial being.

In war, there isn’t really a question of who is right, but isn’t Char personally a bad person?

>>171

It is undoubtedly evil to have killed Garma.

Someone who drops meteors can’t be considered righteous.

>>173

So if I am to be shot by Amuro, then that would be my wish fulfilled.

It’s not short-sleeved, it’s sleeveless.

I understand that both sides have their flaws and the situation is complex, but there are many experts who say things like the Zeon is righteous and the Federation is evil.

Both the Federation and ZAFT being bad is just right.

Putting the factions aside, personally, it’s just like the thread image, right?

Zeon is cool! The Federation is lame! That’s just fine for Gundam!

The model of Geonism is undoubtedly Zionism.

In other words, it is evil.

Char is a soldier.

Amuro is an ordinary person.

There are no good or bad people.

>>182

If you are a soldier, uphold international law.

Amuro, who got caught up in a war while tinkering with machines and ended up being made to become a soldier, is completely a victim.

>>183

In the end, I ended up getting hit by a guy I don’t even know…

Since it’s Gyunei, you probably know the content, so are you intentionally making a joke for the viewers?

Zion always makes excuses, saying “But, but…”

The Zeon aliens are good at playing the victim while attacking.

Jamithov, I will become the villain of mass genocide and save the world!

I’m cutting ties with relatives with that determination.

>>191

That said, it’s just a means to an end…

Char is a mother complex in a complicated way.

You’re the one who was able to break free from being a mama’s boy, right?

>>192

You’re not pinning such expectations on your mother that you’d become a mama’s boy, are you Amuro?

No matter how well you put it, Char from Char’s Counterattack is completely insane, and it’s a bit of a mystery what motivation his followers have to obey him.

>>195

Captain Musaka gives a very simple answer: “I want to crush the elite Earth.”

You’re so eager to show off your knowledge that you can’t read the context.